In this episode, we're joined by Claire Daniels, CEO of marketing and web agency Trio Media as we discuss all things leadership and why the phrase "career ladder" has to go. 
Zach Greaves 00:02 
Welcome to Words that Work. My name is Zach Greaves, Founder and Director of Artus Digital Marketing. We're here to empower businesses to tell their story through compelling copywriting and content. 
In Words that Work, we discuss storytelling as a tool for business success, while celebrating the unique stories of our clients, collaborators and listeners today, as usual, I'm joined by my co-host Liv, and we're also joined by Claire Daniels, CEO of Trio Media, a marketing and web agency based in Leeds. Claire is also a trustee for the children's heart surgery fund and conservation circle member for Rain Forest Trust UK. So, a big welcome to you, Claire. 
Claire Daniels 00:49 
Thank you. Thank you for having me on. 
Zach Greaves 00:51 
No, thanks for being our first guest. Really delighted to do this with you, as one of our collaborators in business too. Great to be working with you. So, Claire, I think we'll kick off then, let's learn a little bit more about yourself. We've heard the headlines there, the CEO of Trio, but perhaps you could just tell us a little bit about your career to date, your life outside of work, and the business as it stands. 
Claire Daniels 01:21 
Yeah, of course. So, I'll yeah, I guess I'll start from now on go backwards. And thank you for the intro already. You stole some of my limelight. But that's fine, I’ve still got more to talk about. 
So yeah, I run digital marketing agency Trio. I didn't actually found the business. So, it was set up just short of five years ago, initially by my sister-in-law, and one of her friends. And my own personal kind of professional background has been in strategic marketing and client-side roles. So, it's previously working as head of marketing in a couple of different tech companies actually in Leeds. And due to an unfortunate turn of events that I won’t go into, I quit my job, because I needed some time out of work. 
And I then started helping out with Trio just to say, look, I've got a few hours if you want some support. And anyway, getting involved, I'm not one to do things by halves. So, I couldn't just get involved a little bit. And I've soon ended up just kind of taking over how the business should be run and trying to do it my way. 
So, I bought out the founding directors about three years ago now and I've been running the company myself ever since. Really pleased to say we've had year on year growth, businesses going great. We work with a lot of amazing clients across such a range of industries. And yeah, just really, really loving it and really grateful for the opportunity that you know, I was able to find myself in to be able to buy the business because I do recognise the advantage of I skipped all the hard stuff, you know, of setting up a business and I managed to kind of jump straight in and do what I'm good at and help improve the performance of a company and help grow a company. 
So that's, the Trio side of things. And then along with their charity stuff, I have my fingers in some of the pies as well. So, my husband and I renovate properties as well. I mean, much more my husband than me, but I definitely love to knock down a wall here and there. And I've been spending my recent weekend stripping wallpaper. So, we've now set that up as a business that we're planning on scaling over the next few years as well. So yes, very busy. 
But then, in terms of anything else, just kind of tracking back in, in earlier career. I mean, to set the scene, I studied Marketing Management at uni, you know, I think it's quite rare that people end up in a career that they studied. But I did study that and I've always loved marketing. And I've just been kind of working my way up ever since always looking for opportunities, new roles, new things, I could do gain an experience wherever I could. And I think all of that has really helped shape me to get me where I am today. 
Zach Greaves 04:11 
Incredible. I mean, I knew that you'd sort of taken over Trio after it had already been founded Claire, but yeah, it's just incredible to see the stamp that you've put on it since joining so congratulations on that. And was it always your aim to start your own? run your own business them? 
Claire Daniels 04:34 
Well, you know what, and you know, even with the same start and then changing to run. Yes, I have always had a very entrepreneurial spirit. I have started several businesses in you know, throughout my career. 
Once I started a vintage clothing company with my friend as a little side hustle and we'd buy and sell vintage clothes. When I was at uni, my boyfriend at the time and I set up a club night running events. So, I've always wanted to get into things. And I actually did always picture myself having my own marketing agency one day, and I think I must have manifested it, you know, 100% because I did always think that would be where my route would take me. 
Interestingly, I thought that more than in those early days of my career, and I mentioned, I worked a lot in client side. But I did have a couple of stints in agencies, and I hated it really hated the culture. A lot of marketing agencies, especially the legacy ones are all about how many hours you work, obviously, we're in such a different time now. 
But you know, 10 years ago, it was about how early you get there, how late, you stay just all about the glory of overworking. And I work hard, but I'm actually really efficient worker. So, you know, there was raised eyebrows, if I would leave. Basically, if you left before 7pm, it was frowned upon. So, I hated it. 
And that kind of put me off agencies actually, I mean, one, one of my roles in my career, I am a company, I'd been working at client side, I was dealing with the agency, and got quite close with the owner there, you know, on a professional level, and told him of my aspirations of having a marketing agency one day, and then anyway, they were looking to grow, they were based in Peterborough. And he really believed in me and saw a light in me from when we were working together. So he actually employed me to set up a Leeds office for their agency. So, I'd kind of quit my job and said, yeah, I was going to do that and set up a Leeds branch of this agency. 
But I mean, I think I was like, 24/25, I was so young, and I was in this office on my own, trying to grow a business. And I was just thinking, actually this is not for me, you know, it was horrible. I was so detached from the rest of the team. So again, kind of having little tastes of it, but it just not being the right time. 
And then, you know, I really do believe everything happens for a reason. I mean, I said, I wasn't going to touch on it, and I'm not going to labour on it. But basically, my brother passed away, which is why I quit my kind of high-flying corporate job and didn't work for a while and then got involved in Trio. And I just think, I'm not going to look back negatively, I think like my path has led me where I needed to be. 
And you know, I had the opportunity to have the space out of work, and then to be able to come get involved in Trio. And all of a sudden, you know, you kind of look and go, everything I've been working towards and been aiming for, has brought me exactly where I was meant to be. 
So, it does take some hard times. And I think as a business owner, it helps to know your own strength and what you can really go through. And I think it's why I have every faith in myself that I will achieve great things because I have no doubt in my mind that I can go through anything and come out better from it. So yeah, maybe went a bit, a bit deep there. 
Zach Greaves 08:14 
Extraordinary Claire. 
Liv Morley 08:16 
It's inspiring, really. It's so amazing that the journey wasn't a straight line or a straight ladder. I mean, I'm freshly graduated. And it's so fab to hear that. 
Claire Daniels 08:28 
And I think the term if I can just say the term career ladder is just so wrong. Because you know, if you think of the analogy of a ladder, you literally get this thing, you prop it up and you just walk up in it gets you exactly where you want to go. 
You know, whereas I think career path is a much more appropriate analogy, like you have to walk along, but you don't know which way you go in. And I think Liv especially people, you know, like you coming out of uni and people of your age, because I was like the last generation that didn't grow up with social media. So, I wasn't really comparing my journey to others. 
Whereas there's so much comparison now, so many overnight successes, you know, Gym Shark founder, Steven Bartlett, all these people who seem to make it really easy and make everyone think they can do it. But actually, it takes a lot of grit and resilience and knockbacks and determination to get where you go in you know and think you can absolutely achieve anything. But currently, there's a bit of a misconception that it can be achieved overnight. And it can't but look, I'm still only 33 I think I've done well, for my age, but I've also got a lot, a lot more to do as well. 
Zach Greaves 09:40 
It's extraordinary, isn't it? And like you say, you know, you look at Gym Shark and Steven Bartlett. And on the surface, yeah, they've just sort of appeared overnight, but you don't get that sense of the story here without scratching beneath the surface and digging a bit deeper. 
Claire Daniels 09:58 
And even people have that the same age as me that might go, oh, well, I'm not where you are. I'm like, yeah, but you weren't travelling for two years, or you like had a child or all these different things like I left uni, and I've not stopped working, I didn't go travelling, I've since kind of been at school and going into uni, I was like, the one thing I can take control of and shaped for myself is my career. 
So that's what I'm going to do. I can't control my family life; I can't control the people around me, but what I can control is me. So, what am I going to do to give myself the life that I want? You know, and I think that's really important. So, you've got to work at it. And you can't just get to a point and compare yourself and go, why don't I have everything that they have? Because it takes a lot of hard work to get there. 
Zach Greaves 10:46 
Absolutely. And one thing we were talking about before we hit record today was that passion, Claire, and that certainly sort of shines through. And, you know, I think you do need those knock backs on your journey to be able to harness that passion sometimes and channel it in the right direction, don't you? 
Claire Daniels 11:07 
100%? Yeah, you know, I think the setbacks are the hard times. And the challenges are more what shape you, you know, I pride myself on being a good manager and a good leader. And, when I look back as to what shapes that, it’s through the bad experiences I had from people who managed me and thinking I'm never going to do it like that. So, you learn so much through those bad times, that really helped shape you and set you on the path that you need to be on. 
Liv Morley 11:37 
It creates such an authentic story as well. I mean, Words at Work is all about storytelling in business and those sort of authentic personal stories about the challenges that you've faced creates such an authentic story adds so much to a company I think. 
Zach Greaves 11:54 
it does. And I think what's so evident in Trio, which while your story and company ethos is so clear for people to see, you know, on your social media feeds, how you present yourself every touchpoint it's really clear and an authentic sorry to repeat that word, but it is. Word of the day. 
Claire Daniels 12:17 
And it was on my notepad for later. 
Zach Greaves 12:19 
Ah, there we go stealing your thunder yet again, Claire? So tell me, Claire, how do you go about creating that company culture making, and getting people to buy into that? 
Claire Daniels 12:35 
I believe that you can’t make culture, I mean, our culture has probably changed three times, in the time that I've been, I've been well in the business, because different people come in, and they shape it, you know, people come in who are more loud and fun, and then they want to do things, and that, that becomes part of your culture. 
So, I think it's really hard to define and you know, a lot of people would probably think it's something that you can make, you know, I mean, look, we've got the green walls, and the pink neon signs, and all these type of things in our office that look like the Instagrammable office. And I think people sometimes mistake that for culture, you know, like the business, is it cool? Is it fun, whatever. To me, the culture is about how people feel when they come here. And I think that is fostered through Yes, what I can do, and the environment I can create, and given people the opportunity to be themselves and be open and honest and real. And then also the environment that subsequent people come in and also create, you know, because look, we've all seen probably different workplaces, if you have a bad egg that affects everyone. So you know that that still affects your culture. 
So yeah, I think it's really important to address that if you do have any of those. But yeah, it's just about being human. You know, like, everyone here knows my story. But it's not. It's not like I'm here to tell a sob story. I'm more here to inspire people and to go, look, we can create something really special here, and we can be in it together. 
And I was actually really proud last week, we were interviewing, we're looking at adding two more roles into the business and a member of my team was interviewing some candidates with me and, you know, hearing her talk to prospective clients about what it's like to work here and about, like how they feel part of something and the pride they take in their work. And it's just a feeling that you can never describe. And you know, every company I've worked at, has been like, oh, we're like a family, and I think a lot of people use that. And actually, yeah, I'd say more the way our culture works is we're like friends. I think that works better because families are dysfunctional, whereas friends are people that you choose to spend time with and that you enjoy spending time with. We're much more like a group of friends than we are a family. Even though I get told that I'm like the mum. 
Zach Greaves 15:08 
You can't avoid that Claire. That’s remarkable and I suppose then that kind of ties into the next part of the podcast in terms of the biggest successes and challenges you've had in business and how that's influenced the story of Trio and the culture itself, too. 
Claire Daniels 15:35 
Yeah, so there's been quite a few. And you know, some of them are small, just as much, some of them are big, but they're meaningful to me, you know, we've achieved a lot just this year, and a lot of things I'm really proud of, like, we've moved into our own purpose built office that we've had designed, you know, we've got 12 people about to be 14, we've just had our best ever, month on record that has been 35%. Better than any other month previous. 
Yeah, so and, you know, there's lots of little things that could be lining up to that. So for example, in June, we joined up and we joined the official pilot scheme for the four-day work week. And that's something I've been really proud of, and one of the things is they say, apparently businesses that do that, you know, make more money. And is it a coincidence or not, who knows, it's too early to tell, but the fact that you know, the second month, then we've had to record month, even with everyone doing one day less, and you know, they're all getting paid full time. 
So, it's things like that just made me really proud. I mean, I've got goosebumps, it's like someone else is telling me my story, you know, with stuff like this, because I've got goosebumps thinking about it. And, you know, they've created a place to work where people get genuinely rewarded and satisfaction out of their work, like, the greatest thing to be, that I will always get is like being able to help other people and see them flourish and support them. 
And that, to me, achieves success if I've created a workplace that people love working, and people have been able to kind of create their own stories through working here. So yeah, so many successes, part of the four-day week stuff we got on TV, we got a radio. So, we achieve loads of press coverage, all organically not using a PR agency, this with people contacting us, we didn't reach out to anyone. We've won this year to kind of big household brand names. So, everything is kind of going in the right direction. I just feel so lucky and so proud every day of what we're building here. 
Zach Greaves 17:48 
Well too right, you should be Claire. And just so delighted to see that success and hear about that. 
So, so let's go into the central theme then. Talking a bit about marketing and storytelling now. And really, for me, I think the one and the same thing. What are your thoughts on storytelling as a tool for marketing? And how do you capture that through your services? 
Claire Daniels 18:21 
Yeah, I mean, I think you're absolutely right, Zach. You know, they are one in the same because marketing is the promotion of you know, product or service to get somebody to want to buy in like to part with their money to continue what you have. And the most beneficial way of getting them to do that is through having a compelling story, demonstrating the value that you can offer versus another brand. 
So storytelling is a huge part of that. I mean, for us something that we've implemented over the past kind of year or so is with every new client we bring on, when we design and build websites, we do search engine optimisation, pay-per-click social media, and all other sorts of content creation. So, it's quite a mixed bag. But there is, you know, there's always an element of kind of brand and, and content that goes into any of that. 
And we introduced our own little model called the top 20 reasons and you go through five reasons people buy from you five reasons people don't five reasons people choose to come back and five reasons that that they don't. And it gives us a really compelling insight into actually why people are consuming a product or service. So, all too often you find people whether it's marketers or business owners make the mistake of you know, you'll ask them what their USP is, and they just list, oh well, it's because we've been around this long and we've done this and we've done that. And then you might ask them, okay, what was the reason the top reasons people bought from you? And none of those USPs are listed, you know, it's something totally different. 
And so, we want to know those things and get into that. And we then use that to tell a story around the marketing and to deliver them better results. Because if we know the reasons people are buying from you, that's what we use in your marketing. You know, that's the story that we need to be telling is, this is why you should shop from us, you know, whatever it may be. So, yeah, that just comes hand in hand with the whole marketing piece, really. 
Zach Greaves 20:33 
Absolutely. There's no substitute is there for discovering that from the customer's perspective. From the end customers perspective, rather than not your clients, as a marketing agency, you've got to dig further, haven't you and wind it back to the end customer that that is so important. I think businesses time and time again, we see like you've said, they've got their idea of why their customers buy from them. But there is that disconnect with the customer. 
Claire Daniels 21:07 
And I think as well, you know, there's potentially a misconception that storytelling in marketing is always it was maybe a bit fluff in terms of always trying to tell a story when you don't have something tangible. But it's not because the story you're telling could be that you are the cheapest and the best value. 
And this is what you need to just get your day to day done. And that's fine. That's there's still a story to tell. Because if people don't know you're the cheapest, they don't know the perceived value of the product, then they're still not going to buy from you. So, there's still that story to tell, you know, there's a reason. And storytelling isn't just around written content, I think as well. That's another misconception is people think, oh, it's the way that you write about yourself. Storytelling could be the way a retail store is set up and you're expected to navigate your way around it. You know, I was watching a tech talk last night about TK Maxx and how they are so deliberately set out you think it's just like a jumble sale, but it's all deliberate, to get you to buy more things, that storytelling because storytelling is taking people on a journey to get them to a desired outcome. So, it's just as much in the way you set out your store as it is the way you write content for your website or the way you create a video for your social media or Tik Tok or podcasting or whatever else it may be. 
Zach Greaves 22:33 
Yeah, all of the different formats. Absolutely. So, tell me about those different formats then that you tell stories on through your business, Claire, and how you adjust that storytelling accordingly. 
Claire Daniels 22:48 
Yeah, so I'm going to start with video because video is just the most popular platform or if it's not, you know, in terms of people's own perception, it certainly should be you know, we've seen the shift now of Instagram basically saying it's going to be video first. 
I say to a lot of people about TikTok when they think their audiences and on there so how many people wishes they could have capitalised on Instagram, knowing what it is now everyone wishes they were there in the early days to have got all the followers and whatever else like those opportunities right here right now on TikTok. 
So, video, whether it's short form, long form, you know, it could be on social, it could be on YouTube, it could be on your website, is a really, really powerful way to tell a story because you could have it tell a story like you and I are doing now you know, we're speaking to each other. You could literally tell the story. Or you don't have to say a word, you know, you can show scenery, you can show products, you can show something that's going to make someone feel something, you know, a lot of sports brands now. 
It's very rare that they will show the products, but they'll show someone running, you know, down a street. It's very aspirational, of like, that's the life I want to live, I want to be that person that gets up and runs at sunrise and looks amazing and is so lean. That is all storytelling, you know, and people don't realise it. 
And that's the power of it is you shouldn't be able to tell when you know that storytelling piece is happening. Something that just makes you buy into brand, and you know, aspire to be one of the people that are seen kind of wearing that brand, for example. You know, with us, I mean, we've spoken because a lot of those examples, I'm giving a B2C but we work a lot in the B2B space and you know, that's predominantly more of my background, but for example, I went to work for three years I was head of marketing at a company called Smoothwall who create an internet filtering solution at stores and schools. And when I got there, it was “this is the SWG UTM”, you know, technical product names: this is what it does, whatever. And what we did was we changed that into “we keep children safe online”, you know, worked with them around the story that you can tell. 
And on the back of that we secured TV coverage, so much press coverage, you know, gained an investment in the business because of everything we did around like increasing stakeholder value with how we positioned the company. 
So, there's so many different ways you can use storytelling to really put across a message and achieve a variety of goals, you know, so you may, you may be trying to sell something to someone, but you may not you may be using storytelling to get someone to come and join your business. You know, like recruitment is a hot topic for a lot of people. So, how are you using storytelling? What's your compelling reason that you're giving to prospective employees to come and join you? 
For example, and you know, thank you again Zach because you said it's visible what we do on our social media. But we have a motto for our social media that you either want to work with us or for us, that is what you should feel when you can see us and consumers and interact with us online. Usually, like that's the place I want to work. And actually, we have that nailed on. Because, you know, the two roles that we're recruiting, I've not even advertised these jobs, we've got an inbox of CVs of people who are applying to work with us because they get it and they can see it from everything we put out. 
So, there's that side, and then the ones work with us, I would say more social media is definitely plays a role in that in that people will look us up and see what we're doing on social media, but the type of clients we're working with, they're not just going to contact us on Instagram, you know, and start the relationship there. But it all adds up. And it all plays a part. 
So yeah, huge, there’s so many different ways to take inspiration from how you can use storytelling. And you know, sometimes it might be in a press release, or in a blog or in something written. But other times it can be so much more. So, you can tell a story through an image, you know, you can tell a story through so many different mediums. And that's one of the things actually with our top 20 reasons exercise that I mentioned is when we say this to clients, and we say, well, we need from you, we need the actual reasons people buy from you. And then you know, upset about the reasons they don't. When we know the reasons people won't buy from them. That's an objection that we now need to handle. 
So how do we handle that? You know, when is it that someone thinks, like, we had a client we did this with recently, and they said all people think we're too small. But on their website, they only mentioned the two founders who were brothers, and we're talking about how humble beginnings they set up and whatever. And I'm like, if you're losing business, because you're too small, this message has got to go, you know, it's actually you're not winning business, because you are brothers and because you've set up the business yourselves, but you know, you're losing it because you’re perceived a small, so how do we change that? 
So, it does take getting out of your own head a little bit. And anything that you thought you knew about what you should be saying about your business, or whatever may be wrong, but when you start looking under the hood and really experiencing, what is it? Why do people work with us? Let's lean into that and do more of that and tell that message, then that's where I think kind of really great things happen. 
Zach Greaves 28:34 
Yeah, sure. And sometimes it's just a case of reframing that message, isn't it? And you know, that it might be that, you know, the humble beginnings of that business that you mentioned, that can be celebrated. Make it a real key USP for them? And in terms of connecting them with their audience. 
Claire Daniels 28:57 
Yeah, it's different. And as well, it's saying, where do we include this in your sales cycle? Yeah, you know, because we can drop this as a really nice piece later on, you know, at proposal stage, this is the background of the company, whatever, but let's not lead with that as the message when that's not the message. 
It's not one of your top five reasons people are buying from you. So, even if with every piece of you, you want to go but this is so much about us, you have to leave that behind and say what do customers want to hear? And that's another one of my kind of favourite sayings is there's a difference between what you want to say and what your customers want to hear. 
All too often businesses are saying what they want to say about themselves, whereas actually, storytelling is probably leaning more into the what the customers want to hear is right in this view. Because if you try to do some compelling storytelling that's so self-indulgent about the business and this is how amazing we are and all these different ways. And that story does not provide any value to the end customer, you've got it wrong, and it's never going to work for you, So it's really about putting the customer first and what they need. And, and leaning into that. 
Zach Greaves 30:13 
Yeah, it can be such a challenge that sometimes can't it Liv? In terms of writing copy, removing those references to we, instead of changing it to you, and really keeping the target audience, front and centre of everything that you're talking about 
Claire Daniels 30:31 
Liv Morley 30:33 
Well, I was just about to say, I mean, I follow the Trio TikTok, and I can see that clear. And I can see how, when you were talking earlier about company culture, and about how you sort of put out there that level of friendship between you, I can see that in ways that I think it's hard to put across marketing in like video, because it's not necessarily something tangible all the time. But the way that you frame marketing and digital marketing on TikTok, I always think it's very clever, how you do it. 
Claire Daniels 31:10 
Good, thank you. And the thing is, you know, so we've just started working with Green Chef who are part of HelloFresh. So like vegetarian, vegan, keto, etc., and working on their TikToks. And you might look at our TikTok channel, and it appeals to the audience that we need to appeal to, but you know, so we might get 2000 views on a video, and you know, that's fine. 
But we also know how to shift and pivot that and, you know, our video for Green Chef that's gone out is currently at 1.1 million views. And that's through recognising the needs of their audience, and very different to the needs of our audience, you know, actually what they wanted. And they've given us feedback, like the content we've created, it's been the best performing it's had the most saves the most shares the most comments. And it's because we haven't just thought about creating a video for TikTok, we thought what the your audience need, what do they want, you know, and the reason it's got loads of saves is because you can see a meal that you would want to have, and it's going to buy, you know, buy you into that. 
And, and one of the things I've been having this conversation with a few people recently, where I think sometimes people are afraid of sharing too much information, you know, because if I tell someone like how to do it, then why are they going to come to me to do it, you know, if you give them those insights, because it's quite a popular thing, especially in the B2B space, you know, tell someone exactly how to do it. 
But I would say it's about telling them what to do, but not how to do it. So when you're looking at kind of explain the story, you know, we're going to create some content around SEO, this is what you should be doing, we're not going to tell you how to do it, because that's what you come to us for, you know, and it's the same with the Green Chef video, I'm going to show you like this meal that we've put together, but you need to come to us if actually you want to find out, you know, if you want the ingredients, and you want all of these things, it's one piece of the puzzle, but that pulls you in a little bit more. And so I think that can sometimes be an easy way, again, for someone to maybe look if they're looking at getting started, what story do I have to tell? Well, what do you do? Can you tell people? Can you give people advice on that on what to do? Just don't tell them how to do it? 
Liv Morley 33:31 
I suppose it's framing things, isn't it that appeals to an audience but present yourself as the expert, you're the person to go to you're the person to educate and that sort of thing. 
Zach Greaves 33:44 
100%. Yeah, it's delivering value through purposeful content, isn't it? And we talk so much about purpose, and understanding that before you write a word in, you can't turn and having that really, at the centre of everything. I mean, we don't put a post out on social media unless it has a purpose behind it. 
Otherwise, what's the point? And how on earth are people going to connect with it? If they don't understand the purpose of it? 
Claire Daniels 34:16 
Yeah, definitely. Well, we know that I have a lot of phrases and some of them I made some of them I don't I didn't. With one of our phrases, though, that we do like is like document don't create, because I think people get hung up. You know, we're talking about storytelling here. And obviously the next link through is linking out with content creation and people that have tried creating content and find it really difficult. 
When you start going just document what's going on. Just be authentic show people part of your business, your life that will probably achieve far more of your goals than, you know, thinking, oh, what is this one piece of content I'm going to create this week and you know, what's that going to do for me? 
So, I think that's a good mindset for people who may feel overwhelmed when they're thinking about content creation to just get started, just document what's going on. Instead of thinking, oh, I'll create something, but what I need to create is like a trending dancing video on TikTok, when that's not appropriate to your audience, it has no use them. Whereas actually, they may be much more preferred you unboxing some new parts to a new product that you're going to launch or whatever it may be. 
Zach Greaves 35:27 
Yeah, simplicity often wins, and the answer is often there right in front of you. It's just a case of the duty of recognizing that and presenting it in the right way. Well, fantastic. Thanks so much, Claire. So, what does the future of Trio look like that you've seen so much growth in such a short space of time? Where do you go from here? 
Claire Daniels 35:57 
Well there’s only one direction that I intend on going. 
Zach Greaves 36:01 
And it's in your logo too, isn't it? 
Claire Daniels 36:05 
That's very much the reason why we have an arrow pointing upwards. But again, not even that. So, for anyone that’s seen the Trio logo, the I's and upward pointing arrow and our logo is in green. If you look at any digital marketing report, when something's going good, you've got upwards pointing arrow and green, when it's bad, you've got a downward pointing arrow and red. 
Everything you know, from the logo and the brand, we're telling a story, you know, in our logo, it's we can get good results, you know, this is what we're pointing to. So, yeah, we definitely see a lot of growth. 
I actually did a session at the end of last year with the whole team a strategy session. And as much as I kind of knew, in my mind what the strategy for this year was going to be, I needed to know I had the right people to deliver it. And I needed to know they believed in it. And they could think as big as I could. 
So, we had a session where we all planned the strategy for this year. And, you know, we've achieved quite a lot of it that we said we were going to do already, which is fantastic. So yeah, just continuing to grow. I prefer to kind of hustle quietly, and not really talk about my plans until I've achieved them, so you can have me back when I've done them. I just don't like saying, oh, I'm going to do this, this and this before I've done it. You know, let success speak for itself that can speak for itself. So yeah, just watch this space. 
Zach Greaves 37:33 
Amazing. I can't wait to see what you've got in store. So tell me, Claire, then what would your top tips be for our audience for telling stories in business? We've heard a lot from you there. But if you could distil it into I don't know, two or three points, what would there be? 
Claire Daniels 37:52 
Well, my first one was authenticity. Back to that word again, obviously, yeah, we spoke about it. And look, I think we made a joke about it, because it's probably overused. But I don't think that should mean it loses the context for where it has value. And authenticity absolutely has its place. And, you know, certainly even for example, we've seen such a rise over the past couple of years in user generated content. And it's because we like the end, consumers want to see someone else buys into this. And it's real, and I can trust it. And you know, we get that through UGC. But there's so many other ways to show it as well. 
So yeah, just showing up and being real. And don't worry about having a pretense, people will see through it anyway. You know, so just be really honest with who you are as brand and who you are, as a person as well. And, you know, be open to that. 
In terms of other tips, I would just definitely recommend doing some of the exercises I've spoken about. So, trying out our top 20 reasons, I really do hammer on about this, and probably more than my team don't even do it and I'm like we do this all the time - they do do it! 
But I see so much value in understanding why are you winning business? Why are you losing business? Why are you retaining business? And then why are you churning business, because once you know that and you'll get under the skin of it, you can really start shaping your marketing a lot better around it. 
So definitely doing that. And then yeah, in terms of telling a story, just thinking about who is this for, you know, so like I said with our social media motto, it's because these are the two people I expect to be looking at our content people who are in a space work in marketing might want to come work for us or work in marketing and might even agency and want us in you know so it's for that reason that we create our weekly three and three, which is three digital marketing tips in three minutes. 
And you know, to give those people content they would want to consume and get them more tied into everything that we're doing. So, when you really understand who is this audience that I'm aiming at, and you start creating content for them, it then becomes quite easy. And yeah, pair that with document don't create, just do what feels right. I'm making it sound super simple, right? 
You know, I know it's hard. But really when you get all these things, right, and you stop having to think about creating content, but who is this for? And who's going to use it? Just go do the work to understand who you creating content for why, then it'll be really easy. 
Zach Greaves 40:36 
Yeah, well, that's it. I think, a lot of the time when you boil something down to its core elements, it is a lot simpler than it looks or appears it's just tapping into that, isn't it? And recognising that. 
So, goodness me we've been overloaded with nuggets today, haven’t we? So, thank so much for sharing that Claire and for joining us today. We really appreciate it. 
Claire Daniels 41:05 
It's been an absolute pleasure. I really appreciate you having me on and being your first guest. And I’m really looking forward to hearing what more comes from the podcast and listening to your future episodes. 
Zach Greaves 41:17 
Absolutely. Awesome. Well, Claire, perhaps before you go, you'd like us to tell us where our listeners can find you online. 
Claire Daniels 41:26 
Oh, yeah. Perfect. Well, you can find me on everywhere. LinkedIn, Instagram, you know, anything. I've got nothing to hide. So, Claire Daniels, you'll find well, most of those places are Trio. You search Trio Media UK, on any platform, definitely check out our TikTok and our YouTube because that's where we're creating loads of content for. But you also can follow us on LinkedIn, and Instagram as well. We are on Facebook and Twitter, but you know, I’m just not so bothered by that. 
Zach Greaves 41:59 
Yeah. Oh, yeah. Brilliant. Thanks so much. 
Well, go and check out Claire, and Trio. And once again, a big thanks to Claire for joining us today. And for sharing her insights and business journey with us. Liv and I will be joined in the next episode with another one of our clients about their business story and our journey so far working with them. So that's all from us for now. Invest in your own story with words that work which is free to listen to twice a month on Apple, podcasts, Spotify, and whatever podcast apps on your device. If you'd like to hear more about our story, head over to our website. 
Thanks for listening, we hope to see you soon. 
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